When you aren’t even pretending to stay on topic (as in post 19), your posts are quite tiresome. If I were the editor, I’d delete your posts on this thread (at least most of them) just to avoid cluttering it up.

Drill, too true about the thorns.

Equally reprehensible:

The Naturalistic Fallacy, page 71 in Two Become One by Donald Joy. “What is prescribes what ought to be.”

The “Fall Model” for marriage and family. The idea that God’s curse is God’s design for marriage.

The view that male control is right just because it exists.

The view that it is right to teach what everyone can see is the way that works in every culture in the world.

As consumers in a free society we can make choices that align with these goals. So then … Pick your Poison: Buy from oil companies that cause the least harm. You can fine the list in the Better World Handbook for Gas Rankings:

Best:
- Sunoco buys NO oil from the Middle East and has a relatively OK environmental record.
- BP

Medium:
- Hess
- Marathon
- Valero
- Citgo - Avoid (Hugo Chavez)

Worst:
- Chevron
- Conoco
- Shell - Blood oil, pollution and murder of innocent people.

Rapers of the Earth!
- Exxon / Mobil

We are worried about a 1 degree rise in temperature over a century. Yet, I just noticed that the US imports more oil from Canada (18%) than any other country. We only got 17% from Saudi Arabia in 2007.

Since oil was produced by tropical rain forests, was Canada once a tropical rain forest? If so, why are we worried about one degree rise over a century?

We do our best, now, I think, and look forward to the restoration the earth.

Reg- While we moderns tend to think of “rape” in terms of sexual violence, don’t forget that the origins of the word lie in the concept of taking and theft. Perhaps there is not only a marital concept, here, in Tony’s words but also an implication of the rape– the taking, if you will– that we and our society perpetuate on each other and ourselves in our sinful and selfish actions, affecting not only the land but our relationships.

– Jonny

I’ve experienced what Drill and others are saying. Most recently through some farmland in Hawaii which my son is trying to “subdue” into a self-sustaining fruit, vegetable, and biomass-producing acreage without the use of any chemicals and without removing valuable indigenous animals or vegetation.

I’m also right there with RRBAR in 9 & 10.